Electromagnetic Effects 2D vs. 3D

Hello dear Flux Community,

I have some questions about the magnetic behavior in PMSM. Attached you see 2 images, one image from a simulation in 2D and one image from a simulation in 3D with the cross-section being at the end of the motor. Comparing these 2 cross-sections. I can see that overall stator and rotor iron experience more flux density up to a depth of 1mm and comparing the rotor iron, I can see these circles with decreasing flux density up to 1 mm in depth. Can anyone explain these effects to me and how they are made? Would appreciate any help or tip!

Thanks and with best regards,

Patrick

M12_2D_CrossSection.png

M12_3D_CrossSection_End.png

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SimonGuicheteau

Hi Patrick,

it is difficult to see exactly what is happening on the 3D as it is the top of the motor. There are probably some end effects due to the end windings on the very top of the machine. Could you look at the middle of the height to compare if you see the same thing as in the 2D model ?

Also can you show a bit more the top mesh, end winding from another 3d perspective ? If this is too sensitive, do not hesitate to create a support ticket.

Best regards

pcolgon

Hey Simon,

thanks for your answer. I had also some 3D effects due to the end-windings and how the magnetic field changes/chooses the easiest way at the top of the motor. The middle of the height is pretty much exactly the same as the 2D model.

I included two different images, one with non meshed coils and one with extruded windings. Both give the same effects. I added also one image with the magnetic flux at the top of the motor and one image showing the flux density at the middle of the height.

Best regards,

Patrick

M12_FluxDensity_Arrows_1.png

M12_Flux_Arrows_1.png

M12_NonMeshedCoils_Mesh_1.png

M12_Windings_Extruded_Mesh_1.png

SimonGuicheteau

It is hard to say something definitive from the pictures. I made a similar 10/12 machine in FluxMotor with spoke magnets and exported it in 3D to compare isovalues. I do see similar circles in the lamination between poles so I guess this is the normal behavior. I don't really see a large difference between the middle and the top though.

Is there anything wrong with your results due to that ? Maybe the mesh is not good enough. I would suggest to use extrusive mesh if possible.

Best regards

pcolgon

Hey Simon,

what do you mean exactly by no large difference between the middle and the top?

I simulated two different setups, one with a medium size mesh and one with a really refined mesh, both containing extrusive meshes in most parts of the motor and both models contained the same effects.

With best regards,

Patrick

SimonGuicheteau

Hi Patrick,

are you able to share your model so I can have a look ? I'll send you a link where to upload, maybe not directly in the forum here.

Cheers